February 1999 Message Archive


Monday, February 01, 1999 at 08:29:14 (PST)
Shane Hall
shanehall@aol.com

[posted by webmaster] I am not sure just how to do this. My dads name was Kenneth Womack born in OK. in 1926 .He was the youngest of 14. He father name was George Womack and his mother name was Rachel Womack. Maybe someone could help me out with my search. please e-mail me at shanehall@aol.com.


Monday, February 01, 1999 at 08:35:31 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

My apologies. That last message was from a Lydia Ruth Womack(Webb). Not a Shane Hall. I was in such a rush to get it up on the message page... -Mark


Monday, February 01, 1999 at 09:08:11 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

In Re: to Lydia, Kenneth Leroy Womack was the son of George Farris Womack and Rachael Mary Ausmus, Their children were; Conzada Oda; Gertrude Paralee; Horace H.; Lester Otto; Oney Louise; Earnest Elijah (my grandfather) George Farris, Jr.; Ester Iva; Daisy Ester; Mildred Lucille; Barbara Lee; Maude Lee; Harold Grant & Kenneth Leroy (your father) So we would be 1st cousins once removed. Barbara Lee and Maude Lee are still living. George Farris Womack Sr. was the son of Larkin Womack and Ruth Meeks.


Monday, February 01, 1999 at 13:54:14 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

While looking through Florida Confederate Pension Application Files on line for another lineage, I came across the following in Record Group 137, Series 587: D24070, WOMACK, Wiley Jonithan, North Carolina, Minnie (Thomason), Alachua Co., 1935, 10 pgs. The pension file can be ordered from Florida Archives, Tallahassee and the cost is $7.50 for the entire file. Thought perhaps someone might be interested. By the way, I also found my ancestor too.


Monday, February 01, 1999 at 18:49:47 (PST)
Joyce Wommack
joylin@henge.com

I received a message from a Colorado list I belong to giving the following URL: http://geneagraphx.com/lost_leaves/lost.htm This site is a sort of "lost & found" department for photo's. The idea is that if you run across some photo's in a sale, auction, etc., you can usually buy them for $1.00 or so. Be sure & ask the vendor for as much info as you can get and write it all on the back, take it home, scan it and donate it to this site and who knows who may find a long lost relative? Sounds like a good idea to me.


Tuesday, February 02, 1999 at 10:40:22 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

I have just posted an obituary for LEVI PRESTON WOMACK in the Vital Records. He was the son of Jacob and Lurena Baugher Womack. Someone that I have corresponded with on WGN has researched Crawford Odam and wife, Sarah "Sallie". I have two different death dates for


Tuesday, February 02, 1999 at 21:02:24 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com
http://www.womacknet.com/message/archive/index.html

December 1998 messages have been moved to the message archive, and can be accessed via the link above. January was a bumper crop month for messages, so archiving the December messages didn't make much of a dent in the download size of the message page. But I'm not complaining! I think displaying the messages in reverse chronological order really helps. Enjoy! -Mark


Wednesday, February 03, 1999 at 08:19:44 (PST)
Johnny Womack Case
jcase@texramp.net
www.texramp.net/~jcase

In Martha McDaniel Thompson's Manuscript she has Elizabeth "Betsy" Booker, d/o James & Phebe Booker married to two brothers, 6.4 Rorie and 6.5 John. Did she marry one then the other? If so, which did she marry first?


Thursday, February 04, 1999 at 12:45:18 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

1870 Attala, Etowah Co,, AL. census list John Womack 36, born abt., 1834 Georgia sp Peggy A. 26. born abt 1832 Alabama. Children Thomas b abt 1854; Mary A. b, abt1857; James b, abt, 1859; John D. b, abt1861; Malissa b, abt 1865; W.P.? b, abt 1869. Trying to find Johns ancestors. John D., born 1861 is the John Davis I have been looking for.


Friday, February 05, 1999 at 10:57:43 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

For those of us that don't know, what line of Womacks did Martha McDaniel Thompson include in her manuscript? Did she trace all of William, the Immigrant's children?


Friday, February 05, 1999 at 12:02:36 (PST)
Ellen Lopez
ellenlopez@netscape.net

I just found this great site and have found info on my ancestor, Benjamin Womack of Cumberland co. NC, but not who his family was.All I have is his daughter Lucy(1769-1844) married my gr-gr-gr-gr-grandfather Henry Browne(1764-1849) in 1789, Wake co.NC.Their son John Allen Brone married patsy Hobbs and moved to Tuscaloosa AL.Can someone help me?


Friday, February 05, 1999 at 14:54:11 (PST)
Mark Womack
markwomack@womacknet.com

Carolyn, regarding Martha McDaniel Thompson's book, it covers the descendants of William the Immigrant. However, Carlos Womack's book has a much more extensive list of descendants by a very large margin. And I think there are a few differences in the early generations. Is that what you wanted to know? -Mark


Friday, February 05, 1999 at 19:36:36 (PST)
Mark Womack
markwomack@womacknet.com
http://newsnet.byu.edu/noframes/show_story.cfm?number=8836

The LDS will be going online in the future...see above URL. -Mark


Friday, February 05, 1999 at 19:37:59 (PST)
Mark Womack
mwarkwomack@womacknet.com

Is anyone out there going to the NGS Conference in Richmond, VA? Just curious. -Mark


Saturday, February 06, 1999 at 09:02:41 (PST)
Joyce Wommack
joylin@henge.com

To: Johnny Womack Case: I have Elizabeth "Betsy" Booker married to Rorie Womack, son of John & Elenor (Rorie) Womack.


Saturday, February 06, 1999 at 13:15:47 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

Mark, looking forward to LDS online. I hope to get out to Salt Lake City this fall to do a couple of days research, but this will be a bonus. Thanks for the information about the McDaniel Thompson book. I had never heard of it. As you know, the Carlos Womack book had a lot of incorrect information regarding my Jacob and his descendants, so I am still gun-shy re some of his earlier generations; however, if I can ever connect my Jacob to Green Womack, I may feel a little better about it all! Back to researching this family after taking time off. Enjoy your new format. You have done a terrific job with this website. If anyone is interested, DAR Library is now online. It can be reached at dar.library.net They will make photocopies of pages re your ancestor, if you find something of interest. You don't have to be a member to receive this service; however, your cost is a little more. I found a book re an ancestor I am tracing in Fairfield Co., SC (another line)and am looking forward to receiving the photocopies.


Saturday, February 06, 1999 at 15:49:22 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

In Sams, 1850 ceusus index for Tennessee, it list Rachell Womack, 44, with children; John, 21; Mary Jane, 18; Susan, 15; Benjamin, 11; Smith E., 9; Ligurson?, 6 and Crockett, 3. In the 1880 Arkansas soundex, it list Crockett, 32, in Boone Co., AR; sp Elizabeth. Children: Mary, 11; Alice, 7; Julia, 5; and Minnie. I believe this to be the same Crockett. Does anyone have any information on this family?


Saturday, February 06, 1999 at 15:55:50 (PST)
Evelyn Hudson Ramos
Eramos1044

Looking for info on Pleasant M. Womack Born 1815 In Tenn. According to the 1850 Madison Co. Ark. War Eagle township Cences Marrie to Elizabeth Born 1820 In Tenn. Children All Born in Ark. Nancy age 18 Nicey "16 Patsy " 14 Mary Elizabeth "10 my g- g-mother Married William Counts Bowen Lucinda " 7 William "6 Thanks for your help . I do have my line of decendants names. Evelyn Thomas " 4 Mahala Emma " 3 My G- G- mother Married Francis Marion "Fed" Bowen Brother to William. John "1 Died Blind


Saturday, February 06, 1999 at 16:32:40 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

The DAR Library site is http://dar.library.net not www. Sorry, folks.


Saturday, February 06, 1999 at 17:02:47 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Doin this on notebook so bear with me!! Any way ran across a query from a Peggy Meek Scarborough, looking for Her Womacks in Norman OK..seems like Ole Jim Garner got another cuz heah..ROGER directed her to WGN home page and GIGI and yer article. Appeahs another success?? What is neat about this one Is I got Scarborough too!!!


Sunday, February 07, 1999 at 18:51:31 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

In re: Evelyn Hudson Ramos: If the information you posted is correct, Pleasant M.Womack born 1815 was 17 and spouse Elizabeth born 1820 was 12 when Nancy was born, certainly not impossible, but uncommon. I have a couple of Pleasants in my database, both being born before 1815.... Pleasant Henry Womack born abt1804 seems to be accounted for but Pleasant B. Womack born abt., 1783, illegitimate son of Sarah Womack fathered by Humphrey Brooks in Halifax Co., VA., before she married Isham Reves. I don't have any descendants on him. Sarah was the daughter of Thomas Womack and Sarah Owen. Perhaps someone has info on him or at least it may be a place to start. Pleasant was a pretty uncommon name in the Womack's.


Sunday, February 07, 1999 at 20:53:53 (PST)
Jamie Ayres
badnewsayres@yahoo.com

Thought I forgot about ya'll didn't ya? No not really, just busy typing in hundreds of names in another line! Anyway while researching my Darr line, which would have never made it this far without a Womack, I found some Womack names looking in the cemetery book for Rockwall/Kaufman County Texas. What/who I found was...W.M. Womack, March 12, 1853 - Oct. 28, 1918; Willie Womack "Mother" 1883-1965 buried next to Marvin Womack "Daddy" 1880-1946. All three are buried in the Royse City Cemetery - Texas. This is in east Texas. Just thought maybe somebody might could use this little bit of info, although haven't seen anyone looking for Texas Womacks here, there are a few! Good luck all, I hope this helps someone. Jamie, Texas PS. missed ya Sam! anymore trivia?


Sunday, February 07, 1999 at 21:47:57 (PST)
Wanema Womack Bullard
wanema1723@aol.com

I am desperately searching for the parents of James Henry Womack born ca.1837 in TN. I found him living with William Harris in the 1860 census in Panola Co.,TX. He was 24 years old and working in a grocery store. He joined the Civil War, Tenth Texas Cavalrly at the beginning of the Civil War. He married Amanda Jane Forsyth in Nov. 1865 in Panola Co. TX.


Monday, February 08, 1999 at 09:53:46 (PST)
Pat Wommack Jones
pjones@ala.net

I found this message on another site, Thought I would share it. PJ In case anyone hasn't heard, Ellis island is doing a project for putting immigration records in digital format. You will be able to order a printout of them without having to go through the laborious process of waiting for someone to search for your ancestor. Their database should be much more responsive. Check out the URL at http://www.ellisisland.org/history.html.


Monday, February 08, 1999 at 18:42:24 (PST)
Joyce Wommack
joylin@henge.com

Re: Pleasant B., illegitimate son of Humphrey Brooks & Sarah, daughter of Thomas & Sarah Womack. This Sarah was a sister to "my" Richard. Carlos' book says he was raised by Richard and Ruth, but another avid researcher of this line, Jean Lurvey, says he was not raised by them. I don't have any further information on Pleasant B. His mother was 45 years old when she married Isham Reavis/Reves. She died in Missouri.


Monday, February 08, 1999 at 21:22:01 (PST)
Patsy Seay
Rayseay@aol.com

I haven't read all the messages in the archives so I don't know if my question has ever been covered. In a book, "HISTORY OF TEXAS", c 1896, Lewis Publishing Co., Chicago, and on the cover page it reads, " supplemented with Biographical Mention of Many Prominent Persons and Families of the State". It is like a Goodspeed book and the people mentioned are people from central Texas. Anyway, there is a biographical sketch of Abner Carroll Womack of Bosque County, Texas (he is the son of Abner Pryor Womack) and this article says that the ancestors of Abner C. Womack came from Scotland; that the ancestors came from the land of hill and heather to this country about 1670. Have any of you all ever heard anything about the earliest Womacks being from Scotland? Thanks, Patsy Seay (gg granddaughter of Abner Pryor Womack) McGregor, Texas


Monday, February 08, 1999 at 22:21:37 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Patsy, These histories, like GOODSPEEDs, tried hard to present a fair and accurate accounting of facts..but they just plain were off the mark in many areas.. for instance, GOODSPEEDs centenniel history of AR indicates that the father of some of the Womacks that went to AR was Jacob Womack, who fought in the REV War, etc and so on....that Jacob Womack he refers to is not the one that was in the RW, the one he refers to is his cousin of the same name and about 20-25 years older than he..it was his grandfather's brothers son..The original Womack Genealogy Volumes had an article expressing the same notion about Womacks from Scotland...Possibly true, they left England went to Scotland for a spell, then came here..some of the Scots went the reverse way, Scotland to England then here. Then, how do you account for the Womacks from Holland?? Darren Womack of the UK says his paternal grandfather was from Holland...Another Steve Womack of the UK says his grandfather was a farmer from Womack Water area of the UK..and as far as he can remember the family had been in that area for generations. I think I know a way to find out if there were any in Scotland, may take me awhile and I may bomb out trying, but intend to look..


Tuesday, February 09, 1999 at 08:03:17 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

Don't forget those Womacks that said they were of Welsh descent and those that said their parent was from Ireland!!! :)


Tuesday, February 09, 1999 at 16:24:36 (PST)
Ann McDonald
71210.2533@compuserve.com

The question has arisen, just what is Ann researching down in NC/GA/AL anyway! So, for your perusal, my lost and stray people that I am searching for information on! Mary Avia Womack Paul Grey - daughter of Mansel Womack - possibly died near Vicksburg MS while living with her son Kinchen Paul - he was in Copiah Co. MS in 1850....there are at least 3 Paul and Grey descendants looking for info on her. Lucy Womack Evens? Whiting? - daughter of Mansel Womack - may have stayed in GA when the rest of the family moved to AL. In which case she may have been lurking around Jones Co., GA or possibly Warren Co., GA ca 1820. - Any other stray daughters of Mansel, because given the census count of females in the family unit it may be that we are missing a few. Martha Mitchell Womack first wife of Abraham - looking for her parents. And no, it probably wasn't Edward Mitchell. Martha Watkins? Womack second wife of Abraham. Any info - birth, death, last name, marriage date (sometime ca. 1782-5, probably GA or NC) And the last four children from that marriage - Sarah, Lucy, William G. and Jesse C. - for whom the current information is either non-existant or likely incorrect. Lucretia Womack Howard - daughter of Abraham, mother of "Betsy" - who did she marry? Where did she live? When did she die? And various Rogers/Womack connections, particularly Sherwood's wife Ann, young Lucretia Womack's husband John, and the zillion other Rogers running around. With an emphasis on the John Rogers who was living next to Abraham in Hancock Co. GA. And that's pretty much what I'm up to when I'm up to researching Womacks!


Tuesday, February 09, 1999 at 19:59:07 (PST)
Brenda Dunn
dunnfarm@ejourney.com

Im looking for Womacks from TX, OK. Jesse W. Womack d. 1934. married a Alice C. Jolly d. 1958. Jesse W. Womack is buried near witha falls TX. and Alice was buried at Rosemont cemetery wichita falls TX. (they walked the trail of tears) there children are Guss b. 1895. Frances Eveline b. 1893. H.L b. 1902. Leeno mac b. 1898. Jesse b. 1898. Dollie Poore b. 1891. I now some live in Oklahoma. some born in Alabama. some in TX. any one have anything pleace e-mail me. Thanks.. Brenda....


Tuesday, February 09, 1999 at 20:15:22 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

There has been some controversy about the first Womck tohit these shores..One individual is adamant that we, and many others are all wrong about ole Will the Immigrant...what many of ye do not know is that there has been a lot of behind the scene E mail on this subject..I want it out in the open.. I told the auld phart that when GOD toldme William was not the immigrant an showd me the papers, then would change me mind!


Wednesday, February 10, 1999 at 07:18:35 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Just wanted to share this with you--happened to run across whilst browsing Barnes and Noble site, what caught me eye was one name in particular.. Summon up the Blood: D-Day and the NW Europe Campaign May 1944 to February 1945 the Diary of Cpl. J.A. Womack, Royal Engi(neers) Author: Celia Wolfe... There is also a book called Kings Mountain Men available that is supposed to list a Jacob Womack as a participant...(I heard this some years back but the book is availabe also...


Wednesday, February 10, 1999 at 12:08:09 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Sam, let's keep this civil. I understand that everyone feels a bit protective about the early Womack research, but if we can't objectively discuss and defend it, then the entire exercise is pointless and we all look like idiots. And for those of you that have ABSOLUTELY no idea what I'm talking about here, I was recently contacted by a Mr. Homer Wilson. He wrote to tell me that based on his own research, he believed the premise that most Womack's descend from William The Immigrant was false. He feels that everyone descends from a Richard Womack, and that the William we all call the Immigrant is one of his sons. At least that is how I understand it. He has sent me his documentation, and I have been forwarding it to other researchers like Sam, Roger, Ann, Ray, and Miles. If there is someone else out there that would like to see it, let me know and I can forward it to you. However, this whole thing has brought home the point that we need to have an article that spells out the evidence and doubts for William The Immigrant. So, I am currently working on an article that will spell out the proof for William and spell out the proof from Mr. Wilson. Once I get this done, we can all have an intelligent discussion here on the message page. I don't know if we'll be able to conclude anything, but it will be informative, I'm sure. -Mark


Wednesday, February 10, 1999 at 15:12:55 (PST)
Miles K. Womack, Jr.
mylzw@worldnet.att.net

I have found the challenge to the early research quite refreshing. I tend to hold to the established tradition, but I think a healthy family review and discussion may bring a breath of fresh air to this forum. Who knows what the outcome may be? We may even find the family secrets that have aluded us for so many years. The worse that debate could do is set up other traditions ending in new possibilities, pointing out that the early issue are unsettled. One the greatest problems in genealogy is the establishment of the status quo. At that point people stop thinking and close the door to new research possibilities. My comments here are the reasons I have encouraged Mark to open the debate. It will give the long time reserchers a renewed challenge to review basics and toss the potential for genealogical new comers to sink their teeth into real hard core research. This computer thing has offered this hobby a new day. We need to take full advantage of new ideas and new perspectives. I am glad that Mr. Wilson has challenged the status quo. Truth is truth. Let's see if we can find it. Mark toss us the challenge. Thus endith my platitudes. Miles Womack


Wednesday, February 10, 1999 at 20:07:11 (PST)
Bill Nuss
bnuss@hiwaay.net

Back again needing help. Could someone help me with the source on Jane or Mary Jane Evans Allen being wife of Abraham Womack that married (1) Sarah Worsham and (2) ___Summerscales? In tracing lineage of Mary Farley, guess who someone has listed as her step-great-grandmother? You guessed it, Mary Jane Evans Allen, with the disclaimer that they have collected this information from various sources and can not verify accuracy of all info and dates, although all appears well researched and documented for some. Not sure what has happened here, has someone got the information from the Farley genealogy and "plugged" it into the wrong place in the Womack genealogy or the opposite or, the wildest thing, were there two Mary Jane Evans that each married an Allen and then someone else!!! For those interested: Mary Farley's parents were John Farley, Sr and wife, Mary Willett. Mary is shown as one of nine children--the oldest. She married (1)Thomas Womack and (2) Thomas Baugh. According to researcher supplying me information, John Farley, Sr. was son of Thomas Farley and Jane Molyneux (dau of Richard Molyneux, Earl of Sefton). John was thirteenth of fifteen children. Thomas Farley, grandfather of Mary was son of Roger Farley and Isabell Pumphreys of Towthrope, Yorkshire, England. He was the seventh of fifteen children that Roger and Isabell had. After the death of Isabell, Roger is reported to have married LADY JANE EVANS ALLEN, a widow, and Roger and Jane had two children together. As you can see, I need help determining if we have two with same name here or if there has been an error in recording data and where the error is!! Help someone! Bill Nuss bnuss@hiwaay.net


Wednesday, February 10, 1999 at 20:48:11 (PST)
Bill Nuss
bnuss@hiwaay.net

Discovered my error after posting. Should have read "...Mary Jane Evans Womack, wife of William Womack that were parents of Abraham Womack that married (1)Sarah Worsham..." Sorry about that. Thats how our errors get started!


Wednesday, February 10, 1999 at 21:03:08 (PST)
Bill Nuss
bnuss@hiwaay.net

One final thought on Mary Jane Evans Allen--whatever. This lady must have been a real looker, sensational cook, or both to have been this popular. What you think Sam?


Wednesday, February 10, 1999 at 21:17:31 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Bill, In John Farley, Jr.'s Will, it says; " I give the use of my negro Dickboy to my daughter Mary Womack during her life and after her death I give and bequeath the said Negro Dickboy to my son Francis Farley to him and his heirs forever". It's pretty clear that Mary Farley was the daughter of John Farley, Jr. The confusion comes in because of 3 Mary Farleys. John Farley Sr. married Mary Willett who went by Mary Farley They had a daughter named Mary Farley who married Thomas Baugh. she was born about 1668, Mary Farley that married Thomas Womack was born about 1700 and this sure messes up the dates in some of our date in their childrens births. I've not seen any proof their children were born before 1710 possibly later. I hope the language of the above Will is not an offense to anyone, it was proper at the time. and presented as such. Abraham Womack who married Sarah Worsham and second Sarah Somerseals as I believe it was spelled on the Land patent to Abraham in about 1691, many believe she was his second wife and not the mother of his children and that she didn't come over untill about 1688 based on immigration records. However, I have not seen those records personaly and would like to see the proof if it is out there.


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 04:19:00 (PST)
jan
womack@mcmail

sam, that book you mention by celia Wolfe.... I know Celia Wolfe, she is a history teacher at Ackworth (Quaker) School just outside Wakefield, next to wragby, /w.Yorks. The book is about her late father's war experiences, I think she wrote it a few years back. My father-in-law went to the launch. I met her through the local paper after she wrote a letter about the book, and she came over for lunch. she is related to my husband about 3 generations back and she was delighted to go to Warmfield to see the family font & graves which she hadn't realised existed just a few miles from her home. Small world eh? Jan.


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 04:29:34 (PST)
sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Milady Jan Yer presense (note the english? spelling) has been sorely missed! I ran across a family history the other day whilst searching for our elusive Womacks, and forgot to bookmark it. However I did have the foresight to send the person an E mail asking where he/she got the information that both William Womack and Mary Jane Allen were born in Scotland, married there in 1641 and that both died there, if I remember, William in 1697..she I cannot..sure wish I find the site again. Since you are close to that bonnie land, mebbe you have some contacts or mebbe you know if any of us EVER showed up somewhere in time there.


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 04:41:07 (PST)
sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

On a more local tone, I went to the FHC and got the indexes for the remaining TN censuses...funny, no Womacks listed for 1810 in that book..also found a 6 page outline on a family that originated in TX and many ended up here in AZ. I have talked to one of the descendants of that family and have his info in the Miscellaneous area, the new will be added as time permits..same as the censuses..Also found in the Map area #m8, Sheet 13, Pedigree of a Rev Isaac Denton, some Womacks I hadn't seen before, so copied the lower right corner where they were and am getting that on shortly also...in this case appears two sisters married Womacks, but there are decendants of only one listed. Later on will have the account of Jacob Womack Jr's murder; and the attempted murder of his brother John...so stay tuned..to this network for the latest and bestest in Womack News!! By the way, y'all doin' good now..got some adrenalin going?


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 11:24:46 (PST)
Claytie Jo Reed Shipley
cjore@aol.com

have message in Sept. 1998, have new e-mail wanted to update still working on Womack


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 20:06:46 (PST)
Michaele Burris
burrisbooks@juno.com

Paulino Weaver was a noted mountain man, born abt 1797 in White Co, TN. The only record of his parents names, given in his marriage record 2 Sep 1832 in Taos, NM, are listed as Benito Guivar and Cecilia Guamaca, the closest the Spanish language can cope with the letter "W". Benjamin or Henry Weaver is pretty certain, but the best guess for his mother's name is Womack. She was supposed to be an Indian princess, probably Cherokee. (Ever notice how the only Indian girls who marry into the majority culture are always princesses, or at the very least, daughters of chieftans?) Pauline, possibly born Powell, was known as a half-breed. ANY help on this Womack would be greatly appreciated. Pauline Weaver is a Noted Historical Figure in Arizona, and my 3rd great grandfather. Sure would like to find his mother. Thank you.


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 20:15:18 (PST)
Michaele Burris
burrisbooks@juno.com

Paulino Weaver was a noted mountain man, born abt 1797 in White Co, TN. The only record of his parents names, given in his marriage record 2 Sep 1832 in Taos, NM, are listed as Benito Guivar and Cecilia Guamaca, the closest the Spanish language can cope with the letter "W". Benjamin or Henry Weaver is pretty certain, but the best guess for his mother's name is Womack. She was supposed to be an Indian princess, probably Cherokee. (Ever notice how the only Indian girls who marry into the majority culture are always princesses, or at the very least, daughters of chieftans?) Pauline, possibly born Powell, was known as a half-breed. ANY help on this Womack would be greatly appreciated. Pauline Weaver is a Noted Historical Figure in Arizona, and my 3rd great grandfather. Sure would like to find his mother. Thank you.


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 20:27:04 (PST)
Bill Nuss
bnuss@hiwaay.net

Thanks to those that emailed me or posted on WGN correction to Farley and helped me get that record straight. Looked at LDS records again tonight and for anyone using them, add about 15 years to dates of birth they have on children of Thomas and Mary Farley Womack and that should work out about right. I first tried 20 years (approx 1 generation) but that was too much as Abraham, Jr. would have been having children at a mighty young age!!! Thanks for all the help on that one. Does anyone know if William and Lucy's Josiah died in Carroll County, TN (where he was, I believe in 1840) or did he leave there and move somewhere else before death. There is no will or division of estate there. Still need help on that Josiah!


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 21:21:52 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Abrahams. Can anyone tell me who were the Abrahams in Amelia and Prince Edward Counties VA. 1741-63? An Abraham Sr. and an Abraham Jr. are in the tax records 1746-52/3. Abrahams appear in land records mostly on Saylor's Creek and Sandy River, but also on Codey's Creek, 1741-63. Wives names mentioned in records are Elizabeth and Jane.


Thursday, February 11, 1999 at 22:00:46 (PST)
WADYNE LINDBERG
deanll@webtv.net

Am searching for info about my ancestress, MARTHA, widow of ROBERT FERGUSSON, of Henrico Co. VA. Before 1730 land transactions of sons, including James Fergusson, MARTHA (who may have been ne Baugh) re-married, to ABRAHAM WOMACK. Whether he was Sr. or Jr., I don't know. Data about any of them would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.


Friday, February 12, 1999 at 13:38:57 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Carlos 1990 edition list Abraham born abt., 1726 sp Elizabeth Stubblefield descending from John, Abraham being Johns grandson. Due to recent information from Joyce, having a letter written from Josiah son of Abraham claiming and inheritance and from the statements made in this letter you would definately assume his line was from Abraham sp Sarah, rather than John, The problem I am having is with the dating. The Farleys have done some pretty extensive research, .... WFT vol., 1... list many of their Wills and lots of source info, And based on the info they have out there Mary Farley that married Thomas Womack was born about 1705. 4th in th line up of children. If that is close to correct then I would assume she was at least 12 before she started having children and Thomas her husband was already a bunch older. So for their son Abraham to have as son Abraham Jr. born 1726 who married Elizabeth Stubblefield is hard to figure. lets say Mary was born 1700 and had Abraham in 1714 he would have been 12 when he had Abraham Jr. I'm having a little trouble with that. I certainly see why Carlos had him where he did. Why don't anyone want to come from the loins of John? In all seriousness this needs to be searched a little closer. If the letter from Joshua is authentic then something is wrong with the Farleys info, but John Farley Jr. was clearly the father of Mary Farley who married Thomas Womack. Any help on this one?


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 09:55:12 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknt.com

OK, I started reviewing some of the Womack sources on the information about William the Immigrant, and I have to admit that the citations are pretty slim in regards to him. Carlos Womack's book The Descendants of William and Mary Jane Womack discusses him at length, but does not provide any citations for any of it. At least that I can see. Maybe I didn't copy those pages or something. The Womack Genealogy newsletters mention William, and that they will be covering his lineage, but I guess they never got around to it before they had to close up shop. I can't find an article dicussing William in detail. Billye Womack Tate's My Womacks seems to derive from Carlos' listings, with no substantive citations either. So, my first simple question is simply: What is the proof that there was a William in the colonies during the early 1600's and how does everyone know he married a Mary Jane Allen? Please refer to actual records, no previously written books (unless they list the original citation). I'm doing some of this research before looking at the notes of Ann McDonald (et al) and Homer Wilson in detail. I need to get my feet wet first. I will continue looking. Thanks, -Mark


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 10:07:19 (PST)
Dixie Sharpe
dsharp@clandjop.com

[posted by webmaster; This reunion is for McDonald Co, MO. I will be adding it to the Reunions web page.] I just got the notice about our annual Womack Reunion. It will be Saturday, June 26, 1999 at the American Legion Bldg. in Southwest City, Mo. from 8:30 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. I have not been able to get into the WGN site for several weeks now so maybe you can post it there for me. Anyone interested can contact me at dsharp@clandjop.com or call Quincy Womack Cunningham 1-918-589-2284 or Dorothy Shields Beauchamp 1-417-364-7662. We usually all bring a covered dish and our genealogy books so we can compare notes or add any information we don't have. We usually have between 75-100 attend and would love to have some new cousins come. They post signs on the telephone poles in downtown S.W. City so it's easy to locate.


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 12:41:27 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Mark. I've looked through the Homer Wilson and Ann McDonald et al papers twice now, thoroughly, and I thought there were two key questions. The first is the one you asked, and having gone through all my papers, I can't find anything to substantiate such a William. I think the other key question concerns the birthdate of the Richard who died 1684. Mr. Wilson puts it at 1655 based on a 1679 deposition for which he gives a citation. Is there any evidence for a different date?


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 13:23:24 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

As long as we are looking at the facts about some long accepted things, let me raise another question, about the usual assertion that the earliest Womacks on these shores were Quakers. I can't find any support for that in Hinshaw or any other record. There is this reference in the Hinshaw VA volume p.293, referring to South River Monthly Meeting which was established in 1757: "The first members of the monthly meeting were old stock Quakers for the large part, of English extraction from the Tidewater section of Virginia, especially Cedar Creek and Henrico Monthly Meetings. Among the first names appearing in the books are . . . Womack . . ." Now what that says is that the Womack name appears in the early records of South River. Indeed an Isham appears in 1758. It DOES NOT NECCESSARILY say the Tidewater Womacks were Quakers, but my guess is that it is possibly the source of Carlos's statement that the early Womacks were Quakers. I have not found any references to Quaker Womacks earlier than the Isham mentioned above, but someone else may have. It is kind of hard to imagine many of those earlier Womacks as Quakers, considering what they got up to; if they started off as Quakers they would have been disowned quickly for such activities as: wife-beating, theft, horse racing, gambling, drunkenness, and public profanity. So here is my question: can anyone give a citation for information showing the early (seventeenth-early eighteenth century)Womacks were Quakers?


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 15:20:34 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

If anyone has access pehaps they can verify these records...William Womack patented Land in the Bermuda Hundred Section of Henrico Co., VA 1665, Ref., CDXVII Century Applic.......William Womack on tithing list in Henrico Co., VA., 1679 Record Book 1677-92, pp 492, 716, 762 Virginia State Library.... Also Valentine Papers Vol III pp 1766-1802 list the daughters of William Womack as Ann Mary and Jane. I have not seen these first hand The records for that era in Virginia is not real good.


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 17:30:05 (PST)
Connie Baumann
littletn@aol.com

[posted by webmaster] Hi Family & Friends..Thanks to Cuzzie Teresa Bivens, I found out another Womac/Womack relative is publishing a book. Was going to wait & tell you all in newsletter, but thought this might be quicker!! We are proud to announce that Mabel Norwood Boylston, granddaughter of David Houston Womac, is publishing a book!! The title is „New Hopewell Baptist Church, The Little White Church in The Dale, 1824-1998‰. The church is located in McMinn County, Tn., and dates back to at least 1833, possibly earlier. The book will be about 600 pages, with over 400 documents & pictures. For ordering information, please contact Mrs. Boylston at the following address: Mabel Norwood Boylston, PO Box 827, Athens, TN. 37371-0827. (Once I find out the price of the book, I will pass the info along to you...)


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 17:36:28 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Roger, thanks for those references. I'll start tracking. Any idea where the marriage to Mary Jane Allen comes from? Is it referenced from someone's will or something? David, I think that your initial assesment of the key questions is correct. I'm still wading through all of it, however. If anyone else has more to add, would love to hear it...Thanks! -Mark


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 20:56:07 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Roger, that must be some bizarre source or sources you have! I have seen before a suggestion of a Bermuda Hundred patent for William but usually with an untraceable reference to "Colonial Virginia Records". As for the reference you ask about, it looks like an application for membership in a group called, I think, "Colonial Dames of the Seventeenth Century". You would need the applicant's name or an application number or something else to follow up; then you would hope to find a citation for the patent in the application. "Henrico Co. VA, 1679 Record Book 1677-92" sounds like a mishmash but your best bet is to ask the Virginia State Library. "Valentine Papers Vol III pp 1766-1802" is pretty clear but the section on the Womack Family runs from p. 1761 to p. 1805, and what page is the reference on? I've done a quick run through and didn't find it but will now do a thorough search.


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 21:43:02 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Roger & David, you realize that if there is a patent for a William Womack in 1665, it would beat out the current earliest known patent for Richard Womack by almost 10 years? Sorry if I am stating the obvious. If that patent exists, we will have to find it. -Mark


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 22:07:42 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

I don't know if this applies since I have still avoided reading Ann's & Homer's stuff in detail, but the Richard that died in ca 1684 with his wife Mary administrator to his will, he was probably age 24 in 1679 (Valentine p 1769) and his wife Mary was probably age 22 in 1679 (Valentine p 1768). This Mary was probably Mary Puckett, daughter of John & Ann Puckett. That much seems clear at least from the Valentine source. Does anyone claim the William Womack of Bristol Parish, Henrico Co, with a will dated 14 May 1718 (Valentine pp 1766-1767) It mentions wife Susannah, son Henry, daughters Susannah, Phebe, Priscilla, Andria, and witnessed by a Richard Womack. And what parish was Bermuda Hundred in? -Mark


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 22:08:18 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLwomack@aol.com

David, That is all I have on the source information. I have never had access to search those records personally, so if don't know if they are worth a hoot. Hopefully someone has access to the records so we can get to the bottom of this mystery. It just seems for a story to be made up with William and his spouse, the widow Mary Jane Allen that someone had some information somewhere. However, sometimes stories are stories. I just want the truth where ever the cards may fall.


Saturday, February 13, 1999 at 22:24:31 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Mark,... The William Womack sp Susannah Trent you mentioned I have as the son of Richard son of the William Womack in question, also the Richard that I believe Homer is talking about as being the beginning of the Womack clan.... I think he is one in the same. As far as Bermuda Hundred I believe it is in the area where the river bends North heading toward Richmond, hows that for Southern directions. A pretty big Civil War Battle was fought there. If I'm wrong there, someone say something.


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 00:44:01 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

OK, I've been burning the oil eating cookies and milk while thoroughly going over my copy of The Valentine Papers. Given just what is mentioned in these papers, and assuming the information and transcriptions are correct, here is what I "conclude": Abraham Womack b ca 1644 (age abt 35 years in 1679 deposition, pg 1769). Abraham had a brother, Richard Womack b ca 1644 (age abt 24 years in 1679 deposition, pg 1769) d ca 1684 (will, pg 1770) married to Mary Puckett (d/o John & Ann Puckett, Richard inherits estate of father-in-law in 1679, pg 1768) b ca 1646 (age 22 in 1679 deposition, pg 1768). Upon Richard's death, Mary becomes administrator of his estate. Mary remarries after Richard's death to a John Granger (1792 suit by Abraham Womack against John Granger complaining that "the orphans of his brother Richard Womack..do very much suffer", pp 1772, 1778-1779). Abraham had another brother, Thomas Womack b ? d ca 1697 (will names Abraham as brother, pg 1794; Abraham contests will of brother Thomas in 1697, pp 1779-1780). And that is all I can conclude from this source. John Womack b ca 1653 (age abt 35 in 1688 deposition, pg 1783) is probably a brother of Abraham's given the age, proximity, and the problems he has with John Granger and Mary Puckett-Womack-Granger (hog stealing, etc). But I could not find a record stating a definite connection. Also, the "Account of cattle belonging to the orphans of William Womack presented by Timothy ? (probably Allen)" in 1677 (pp 1780-1781) which mentions Mary and Thomas Womack is suspicious. It mentions Abraham, but does not mention his family connection. What if this Thomas is Abraham's brother, with Timothy Allen later recorded as having been his guardian (1685, pg 1775). If this Thomas is Abraham's brother, then that would pretty much sum it up in my mind with a William Womack being the father of all of them. But I could find no proof of a connection to this Thomas. OK, that's it for tonight. If anyone has anything to add or feel that I missed something here, post it and let me know. -Mark


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 10:18:11 (PST)
sam womack
samsawadee@uswest.net

Ok finally found that reference to Scotland on a Francis White Family page the note at the botton was where the info was supposedly found--------- 434. William WOMACK (61) was born in 1620 in Scotland. He died in 1697 in Scotland. He was married to to Mary Jane ALLEN in 1641 in Scotland. 435. Mary Jane ALLEN was born in 1615 in Scotland. She died in 1685 in Scotland. Children were: 201 i. Ann WOMACK. ii. William WOMACK was born in 1644. He died in 1674. iii. Abraham WOMACK was born in 1647. He died in 1733. iv. John WOMACK was born in 1653. He died in 1725. v. Richard WOMACK was born in 1655. He died in 1684. vi. Mary WOMACK was born in 1659. vii. Thomas WOMACK was born in 1650. NOTE 61: The Original Lists of Persons of Quality was listed and the source.. Please note that I also ran some other searches in Scotland for Womack and this is all that I could find..cannot vouch (thats a misnomer!) for the authenticity of this information, nor the alleged source.


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 10:35:46 (PST)
Bill Nuss
bnuss@hiwaay.net

Hey, Sam, thanks for the help on the source to that name and the info!! It looks like we really do have TWO Mary Jane Allens in our line. One that married a Womack and one that married a Farley. Thanks so for your time and effort.


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 10:39:42 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Mark,...The William that died and Timothy Allen?, who became guardian of his children according to Carlos, was William Jr., son of William the Immigrant. His children were Thomas and Mary. William Jr., according to Carlos married Jane, mother of said children his second spouse was Abriel Gower who after William Jr.'s, death married William Clarke.


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 14:04:02 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Geography. Roger is right. The Bermuda Hundred area is the vicinity of that big bend of the James River where the Presque Isle National Wildlife Preserve is now, and where present day Henrico, Chesterfield, and Charles City Counties intersect. Curls (Curles)-present day Curls Neck- is adjacent Inside the bend is Turkey Island. Today, the Bermuda Hundred road runs from Turkey Island to Ashton Creek, which I believe is what was referred to in the old deeds as Ashen Swamp. To this day, many creeks in that part of the world are called swamps. Ashton does indeed run into the north side of the Appomattox River. Mark, I have never been able to locate a map of the parishes, but that whole area must have been in Bristol Parish.


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 15:26:35 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

This if from Ann McDonald regarding the reference to the possible William Womack in the 1665 patents. If anyone can lend a hand with this, it would be greatly appreciated by all: "Mark, well, I rechecked. There is NO Womack listing in the Virginia Colonial Records Project - none, zippo, nada - so clearly THAT'S not the reference to 1665. If there is one, and it's a slim chance, it might be that sometime around then, one of his neighbors patented some land and referenced something like "24 rods to Wm. Womack's line." or some such. I don't think those references were indexed in "Purse and Person" just the patents and the headrights, although I could be wrong - not having a library open is killing me right now! I bugged my eyes out today looking for the most obvious culprits, Woodson, Harris, Price, Randolph....no luck so far. I suppose in theory one could take the 1665 at it's word and read all of the patents for that year. Or even worse, start at 1672 and work backwards. However, having bugged out my eyes with about 10 pages today, the 800+ pages for that era would be.....a pain! Like you, short of moving to Richmond and camping out at the Library of VA, there isn't much I can do about it from here. 8-)" -Mark


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 15:33:03 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Looking at data regarding Thomas Womack in the Valentine Papers: 1) Thomas Womack dies in 1697 and leaves a will that is contested by his brother, Abraham (Valentine, p 1794). 2) A Thomas Womack, age 28, gives a deposition in 1692 in regards to the ongoing hog difficulties between John Granger and John Womack (Valentine p 1792). I don't know if this indeed the same Thomas as #1 above. Age 28 in 1692 would have him born in ca 1664. This is within a possible range to be a younger brother of Abraham, brother of Richard. 3) In 1685, Timothy Allen is ordered to deliver to Thomas Womack, lately an orphan under his guardianship, the remainder of gift bewtowed upon him by his deceased mother...(Valentine p 1775). Assuming this is the same Thomas from #2 above, his age in 1685 would be 21. Is this the age where orphans can legally leave their gaurdians? 4)And if this is Timothy Allen, then this is the Thomas that was mentioned in relation to the cattle with sister Mary and some other Abraham Womack (in the Valentine version), relation unknown. Possible conclusion: If the Abraham mentioned in 1677 is the same Abraham that contested Thomas' will in 1697, then they would be brothers and their father would be a William that died before 1677. The only Richard that could be involved is the Richard that died in 1684, and he would be a brother of Abraham and Thomas. There is nothing cut and dry here. It is possible the Abraham's are different or the Thomas's are different. Just looking at this, I can see where someone would think that a William was the ancestor of all of them. I'm not concluding anything here, just throwing this out for discussion. Is there something more that I am missing? Quite frankly, I don't know how anyone has made any sense of all of this. Especially after 1700. There are so many William's and Abraham's by that time, I wouldn't be surprised if there is more than one mistake in that bunch. -Mark


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 15:53:39 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Roger(and Mark and others): I've looked through the Valentine Papers and I can't find any reference to daughters of a William as "Ann Mary and Jane", nor in fact any reference to daughters of a William.


Sunday, February 14, 1999 at 16:01:55 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Oops. Re my last I meant to say aughters with those names. There is the Willam, will 1718, with daughters Susanah, Phebe, Priscilla and Andria ( sometimes transcribed as Audria).


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 06:08:51 (PST)
Todd Womack
Womackelectric@msn.com

As stated above my name is Todd Womack. I am a third generation Womack in the Sandy Springs/Roswell/Alpharetta Georgia area. As far as I know my grandfather Maurice B. Womack lived in the Sandy Springs/Dunwoody area prior to starting an electrical contracting company called Bales and Womack in 1938, which later became Womack Electric. He also built and founded Sandy Springs Plaza shopping mall at the corner of Johnson Ferry and Roswell Rd. in 1955. He has four sons, one of which is my father Larry E. Womack. I have lived in the northern suburbs of Atlanta all my life an am interested in finding out about my geanology prior to my grandfather. My uncle has more information about the family and as I find things out, I will try to post additional information.


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 06:43:15 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Bill--You are welcome--only throws more veggies in the stewpot to simmer about. But if we didnt have so much to dig our way thru, there would be no fun nor challenge to jinny-ollie-gee!! To be honest, I sometimes question the father of me GGGG-GF because he didnt have a brother of the same name to name GGGG-GF after. Which seemed to be the style back then anyway. Mebbe we Womacks bucked the norm and dared to be different(yea right look at alla them Wills, Toms, Abes and Johns cornfoosin evahthang)! Anyway, onliest way we gonna get outta this mess is for someone to find a time machine and scoot back there and find out personally; and, I do not foresee that happening anytime soon!! I'll give you odds that the people diggin into their past 200 years from now will curse us for not documenting our lives any better than our ancestors did.. BTW, I am still trying to figger out who the second Jacob was at Watauga..not a clue tho at this time..


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 11:06:25 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

Thank you all for going back to William, the Immigrant, to prove or disprove the continuing circulation of "facts". Even though I still can not connect my Jacob to a definite father, I am very interested in the earlier generations. I have felt all along that documentation needed to be done on William and hope that someone does finally do it! The messages are good, so keep them coming.


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 12:01:31 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

I forgot to mention in my earlier message on 2/14 that the Mary and Thomas mentioned in the 1677 record were 'orphans of William Womack'. In case you were wondering how I got a William out of that description. Stuff I got from Ann McDonald suggested that this William was a brother to Abraham. But I could find no reference to relation in the Valentine Papers. Are there other records that states this relation? -Mark


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 12:43:44 (PST)
jan
womack@mcmail.com

David, re the Quaker thing. There are lots of Quaker Meeting houses and schools around here. The nearest to us in Leeds is only a quarter of a mile away. It is not common anywhere else in England as far as I know. Although my husbands sister went to the Quaker boarding school in Ackworth (where Celia Wolfe teaches) it was not because Womacks are Quakers but rather because it was the best private school around! G.G.G.father Womack wa a founder of Normanton Methodist Church.


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 16:55:14 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

HI y'all as the sayin goes, "It's me agin, Myrtle!" Seriously two things--I have made contact with someone in Scotland who is connected with Electric Scotland; one of the best on line sources for Scotland you will find. Off the top, he can find no references to Womack in Scotland; but is going to look at them further in conjunction with the Allens who definitely had a Scottish connection -------- Secondly, CAROLYN, since you are a Powell, which Jacob Womack are you looking at? One of me GGG-GF sis's married a Powell, Scott Powell I think was his name..that any connection?? Her father was Jacob Womack, as was me GGG-GF's. Believe these to be the same Powels who went into either KY or mO or Ky on way to MO..


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 18:25:08 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Well, I think all the excitement has achieved something. We are getting at some crucial questions and looking at the data with renewed focus. Some observations follow based on several readings of Mr. Wilson's stuff and the contributions of our regulars and all the material I have access to. FIRST. Mr.Wilson's version of the early VA Womack ancestry hangs on two critical assumptions. One: Richard b.1655 d.1684 cannot have patented land in 1683 when only 18 years of age. I am reminded by it being Presidents Day that George Washington was a professional surveyor in VA at the age of 16 and held public office as Surveyor of Culpepper Co. at age 17. Two: Abraham b.1644 is too old to be the brother of Thomas b.1664. My Grandmother Leman Burson, eighth of her parents' children, was born 16 years after her eldest sister and was 11 years older than her youngest brother. SECOND. Mr. Wilson points out he can't find a shred of evidence for the existence of a William (Wiliam the Immigrant) older than the William, Abraham etc. often given as his children. On the other hand, as he himself says, there is not a shred of evidence for an older Richard (whom we'd have to call Richard 0) except for the patents which he says Richard I was too young to get. Well that seems to be right so far - but see THIRD below - which is sort of a tie score. THIRD. Mr. Wilson seems to have done research only in Henrico records. I've done a lot in other VA counties, but none perhaps in places in VA (or somewhere else in the colonies) where early Womacks might have been before Henrico - except for many of the statewide sources. FOURTH. Sam's February 14 is really interesting! The source it refers to clearly is describing the person known as "William the Immigrant" and his family Abraham, Richard I, John the wife-beater, etc. But it says he never emigrated from Scotland! I've seen that book "The Original List of Persons of Quality" but I guess never looked for Womacks (I've got about 20 other VA ancestor families). Is anyone near a library where they can check it? FIFTH. If Mr. Wilson is right, then we have two Abrahams who were litigious, profane, drunken, bad ferry-keepers. What a family!


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 23:25:51 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

David, I think you have made some very good points. In regards to the land patent to Richard Womack in 1672/73, I have to question the math. 16 years of age would be the lower limit. Richard is "about 24 years of age" in a 1679 deposition. Given the variability in recording ages, let's just say he was 24. That means he was born ca 1655. 1672-1655 = ~17. If the patent was in 1673, then he is ~18 years of age. Seems old enough for a patent to me. Also, the patent was granted on land adjacent to John Puckett, his father-in-law. And there are like 9 people named as headrights. This is not conclusive, but I think it is a pretty good theory that John Puckett collected those headrights and gave them to Richard as a dower when he married his daughter Mary. Not bad to start them out with 460 acres, if you ask me. But it is just a theory. I guess I'd like to know how much land John Puckett had. -Mark


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 23:28:11 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Sam, the Scotish reference you found sounds promising, if true. It sounds too pat to me though. If it was that cut and dry, I don't think we'd be having this discussion about William and Mary Jane right now. But please keep us all informed! -Mark


Monday, February 15, 1999 at 23:30:51 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

So, I'm going to try and go to my local library this Friday. It has an above average genealogy room. I need to look at some books that discuss land patents, headrights, and early Virginia law. Does anyone out there have some good references? I'm going in the evening, and the genealogy librarian will probably be gone for the night. Thanks, -Mark


Tuesday, February 16, 1999 at 08:30:52 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

Sam: My husband's Powells are from GA (Tifton area)>Randolph Co., Lee Co.,GA>? He has hit the infamous brick wall with his David B. Powell's father, Charles. David B. served in the Southern Inconvenience and we know his father was Charles, possibly from VA or WV, but have not been able to document anything. He married a WV Thompson. I have come across this Scott Powell before while researching Womacks.


Tuesday, February 16, 1999 at 12:14:01 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Mark and everybody. On Richard's age etc. If I understand the Old Style/New Style calendar thing correctly, (and I don't guarantee it) the patent is really 1673 so he is 18. About the two drunk Abraham's, I was not entirely facetious. The court records I have of an Abraham being drunk are in 1678 (twice), and 1685. Profanity is in 1686, 1692 and 1701 (specifically Abraham Sr. in 1701). Now, on the age thing again, while it could be close, probably any Abraham brother of the Thomas d.1697 would be too young in 1686, so its either two, or the older Abe all the time. And here's another thing. If Thomas the son of William did have a "real" (i.e. blood brother) Abraham why is that Abraham never mentioned in all the litigation about the orphans of William and their cows? Only Thomas and Mary are mentioned. And if the Thomas d. 1697 is the Thomas son of William why doesn't he mention his sister Mary in his will, since he mentions godsons, goddaughters, cousins, in-laws and his brother to the number of at least nine persons. I think that all this is heavy evidence that the Thomas who died 1697 is not the son of William who had orphans and died 1674, but his brother.


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 10:20:09 (PST)
STEVE TRUSTY
SDWOLAN@AOL.COM

HELLO FROM A YANKEE BRANCH OF THE WOMACKS.MY PATERNAL G.MOTHER WAS CHARLOTTE F. WOMACK,BORN IN INDIANA 1884. FROM A LETTER WRITTEN TO HER FATHER,FROM HER UNCLE JACOB WILLIS WOMACK IN 1902 THE FOLLOWING INFO: CHARLOTTE'S FATHER WAS ALBERT AARON WOMACK,ONE OF 11 CHILDREN BORN TO AARON H.WOMACK. A.H. WOMACK IMMIGRATED TO INDIANA FROM KY. ABT. 1821,SETTLED IN FRANKLIN&SHELBY CO'S. A.H.WOMACK DIED IN BOONE CO. IA 1872-1873 HIS FATHER WAS JESSE WOMACK,A FARMER FROM VIRGINIA. HERE'S WHERE THE INFO GETS CONFUSING ACCORDING TO THE LETTER JESSE MARRIED A MISS BLACKLIDGE,DAU OF ICABOD AND SUSANNA(WOODRUFF)BLACKLIDGE. JESSE ALSO HAD THREE BROTHERS:WILLIAM,JOHN AND DANIEL(HAVE FOUND REFERENCES TO THESE THREE AS BEING CHILDREN OF A JESSE AND SARAH(DANIEL)WOMACK). IN THE ORIGINAL LETTER JACOB STATES THAT AN ANC. FROM HIS MOTHERS SIDE OF THE FAMILY,THE HIGGINS', MARRIED A MISS DANIEL. COULD THIS BE A MISINTERP. OF ORAL GENEAOLOGY OR COINCIDENCE? SO I DONT TAKE UP ANY MORE SPACE,I'LL CLOSE. IF ANYONE IS INTERESTED IN THIS BRANCH,E-MAIL ME. I DO HAVE MORE INFO SUCH AS BIRTH AND DEATH DATES ON SOME OF THE MENTIONED PEOPLE. GREAT WEB SIGHT KEEP UP THE WORK.


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 12:22:43 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

I am glad to see from the intervening message that this discusion about the early VA womacks hasn't scared off everybody else. And we ought not forget that there were some very early Yankee Womacks possibly not conected to the VA ones (although if we ever get back across the Atlantic with a sure connection maybe we might hook up to them too.) Anyway here's another contribution to "who might have been who". Why did Abraham in 1674 get two-thirds of his brother William's estate? And who is the "Win Clarke" who was fighting Abe in court over it? (Valentine p. 1805.) If as usually assumed he was the second husband of William's wife then the Timothy Allen who was the guardian of William's kids was somebody else. Mr. Wilson thinks he was proably a husband but if not, a brother of William's wife. But why can't he have been a father? And I haven't seen the originals but the Valentine references (pp.1780/1) to the Court records show Timothy just as Timothy and not Timothy Jr.


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 12:47:46 (PST)
Lynn Parker
LPa2446710@aol.com

Loking for information on ANDERSON WOMACK b.1765 d.1848 married FRANCIS DOBBINS b.1772 d. 1863 married 1785. Would possibly be from SC. Thnks for any help. Lynn LPa2446710@aol.com


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 13:50:50 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Lynn, The good news is, Anderson was the son of Thomas Womack and Louvisa Rice.....The bad news is I don't think anyone has any proof of his parantage. There was a book written that I think Sam is updating. I have never seen it. I have gathered over 4000 of his descendants and would sure like to have Thomas in the right spot. In Carlos Book " The Descendants of William Womack and Mary Jane Allen" He is listed as the son of William a descendant of John, son of William who we have been discussing lately. So jump right in and help us unravel this mess.


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 15:50:57 (PST)
Robert E. Womack Moore
R6CTommore@aol.com

For another researcher, seek info on a Elizabeth Jane Womack who married Gilford Dudley Story & lived in Pope Co., Ill in 1830s-40s. Thanks


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 18:35:53 (PST)
sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Roger, Yep and am on page 81 with the editing and have scanned thru page 90, only 60 more pages of descendants to go then 10 pages of narrative at the beginning...However, In my looking around and in looking at some other whatever, I found the one line of William to Abraham 01, to Abraham 02, to William 09, to Thomas. Then Big bad John, brother to Abraham 01 had the line that went to the William who married Lucy..I think they were second cuz or is it as they say now, first once removed...gotta do some more lookin on this but food fer thought and discussion perhaps(all numbering mine I have 30 williams without initials or middle names; and 35 with for a total of 65 Williams. By they way Roger, I only mebbe 2200, give or take a few, in the book; of course it is about 25 years or so old...oh well, we got enuff Womacks to discuss till doomsday!!


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 21:02:45 (PST)
Pamela J. Gutsche (Womack)
gravenimages@globaldialog.com

Here is a letter that I have the origanal to. To: Willaim Womack ( my gr gr gr grandfather) Galena Il Dated: June 9th 1842 written by : LeRoy Womack Dear Brother I take this opptunity to inform you that I am will at present and I hope that these few lines will find you and yours injoin the same blessing. I saw mother last friday morning and I believe they were all will. Larkin and John and all of rebecahs children has had the meazles. Rebeccah is married again. I wrote to you some time back stating that I expected to come out there but I have not yet started but if there any thing out there for me to do. I would like if you would drope me a few lines as soon as you can and I will try to land there this fall and if I can't get work at my (bismefs) if you have land enough for both of us to work. I will come and set in with you time enough to make a crop next year if you will not object to it I was free last may and move out of (bismefs) times are very dul here crops are very promising here you will please to give some directions how to come and please to write soon nothing more at present but remain yours LeRoy Womack I have seen copies of letters to William from his mother but can not get copies of the copies. Williams mother tryed very hard to get him back to VA. I hope you all enjoy the letter. I copied it as it is written. Not an easy task to do. I know at one time there where more letters but because of an aunt that now is past away alot of letters where lost or destoryed. It is along story how it happened. Enjoy.


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 22:31:42 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Pamela,..I have about 10 letters from Catherine, Leroy and Larkin to William in Illinois. The originals are in the posession of Nelda Womack in Wisconsin w/o Don A. Womack (deceased) son of Charles Henry Womack, s/o John William Womack, s/o James Henry Womack, son of William above. I'll be glad to send you copies.


Wednesday, February 17, 1999 at 23:45:21 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Sam...The best diagram I have seen as a relationship chart is; Draw a triangle, at the top put William (for now) Down the left side put Abraham, under him Thomas under him Francis, under him William. On the right put Richard, Richard II, Richard III and David. If you draw a line between Abraham and Richard they are brothers, Thomas and Richard II are 1st cousins, Francis and Richard III are 2nd cousins, William and David are 3rd cousins. Here where it's confusing, If you draw a line from Thomas across and down to Richard III, that is a 1st cousin once removed, if you draw a line from Thomas down to David that is a 1st cousin twice removed. and so on. I'm 8 generations down Abrahams line so Richard II would be my 1st cousin 7 times removed. and Richard would be my 6th great grand uncle. I get asked all the time what relation someone is and it does get confusing. I wish you could draw a diagram on this thing. I hope this made sense to everyone who didn't know. Did they figure this the same way back then?


Thursday, February 18, 1999 at 04:43:08 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

OK, I picked up a few notes, but too large to do here so put in a file accessible at http://members.tripod.com/~dubbie/holding/notes.htm Only one Womack, but I think you will find the others interesting and Bill, check it out looks like yer Farleys are there too, real early!!


Thursday, February 18, 1999 at 21:00:24 (PST)
Meredith Campbell Risen
campbellrisen@juno.com

JOHN WOMACK-- RICHMOND, VIRGINIA. Around 1905 "ran off" with a miss MOLLY HARDING, from Richmond, Virginia. One child, Goldie Estelle, my mother. Don't know if WOMACK and HARDING married. HARDING left WOMACK a few months before my mother was born and returned to her home in Richmond. Supposedly went to Atlanta, Ga. with WOMACK. John Womack had a sister or an aunt named "Aunt Katie." in Richmond,


Friday, February 19, 1999 at 05:48:12 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

Steve Trusty: The letter you have from Jacob Willis Womack, 1902, is interesting. I am descended from a Jacob W. Womack who was in Callaway Co., MO in 1902. Do you know where your Jacob was living at the time he wrote his letter?


Friday, February 19, 1999 at 07:18:04 (PST)
Sharon Kay Slankard Hoosier
vinson@connecti.com

Hello, well i suppose this is a shot in the dark, but....does anyone know anything about one Quinton Womack? His fathers name is Seth Womack, and his mothers name is Ellen Walls Womack. The last time i seen any of this family was in Ada, Oklahoma. He has a sister named Barbara. His father was in the oil field business...unsure. I have lost track of this end of my mothers family, and am anxious to reestablish relations. So if anyone can lend a hand here with information...I would be so grateful! My mother and father are both gone now, and i believe all i have left of my mothers people, are these two cousins. Thank you so much for any help! Sharon(Slankard) Hoosier


Friday, February 19, 1999 at 18:00:56 (PST)
Doug McWhorter
GMcWhorter@compuserve.com

I am searching for information on my Grandmother Eliza Bell Womac,born Athens, Alabama 12/18/1880. Her father was,I think, Henry Pryor Womac from Tennessee and her mother was Rintha Ann Berry. Doug McWhorter


Friday, February 19, 1999 at 18:20:20 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

New spelling and it wasnt a coinkydink as it was repeated 5 times on 5 differrent lists or documents:: Wawmack.. Brunswick Co VA.. A William at that!!


Friday, February 19, 1999 at 19:34:07 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

To Sharon Kay; Seth was not a real common name, I have 2 in my database, Seth Virgil Womack b 12nov1889 in Sage, Izard Co., AR and his son Seth b 17aug1912. He may have been a twin to Vernon same date or possibly he was Seth Vernon there was some confusion on the data. I don't know if he had a son named Quinton I do not have any descendants on him. It may be a place to start. Seths are descendants of John the hswb.


Saturday, February 20, 1999 at 10:12:18 (PST)
Joyce Wommack
joylin@henge.com

Mark, David, Sam, Roger & all the rest, I am enjoying the closer look at the early generations. I would jump in here but am too confused. I have looked for so many years for my "missing Abraham" and have gone over all the material so many times, the more I do it the more confused I become. I of course, don't have any proof, but know, just know, that some of these people are plugged in where the don't belong. As to the "Scottish" question, I have 2 copies of family histories written by 2 (half) brothers, ones says they are of Scottish origin and the other says English origin. These half brothers had different mothers and grew up with each other with the same father. I guess that just goes to show how the records can get so mixed up. Back to the current early research, who is Mr. Wilson and what are his research papers you are all talking about? I must have missed something somewhere.


Saturday, February 20, 1999 at 14:33:45 (PST)
Virginia Sue Rieckhoff
SRieckhoff

I am looking for info on William Wesley Womack and his descendants. He was born 1836 and died 1920. He married Sarah McFarrell. He would be my great grandfather. My grandfather was John Henry Womack born 1872 and died 1961. My mother is Hildred(Womack)Wanless. What did WWWomack do for a living?My grandfather was a schoolteacher for many years.


Saturday, February 20, 1999 at 16:44:15 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

Sam! Don't tantalise us! What is the data about the five William Wawmack references in Brunswick?


Sunday, February 21, 1999 at 07:10:49 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

David, didnt have me glasses on straight--there were 4 references, a poll list typed by two different people and the results are as follows(sure wish this would do a straight up and down rather that across and word wrap!: BRUNSWICK COUNTY, VIRGINIA. POLL LIST 1748.... For Col. John Wall William Wawmock..... For Col Edwards William Wawmack ..... going back thru another list that someone else typed and it was Wawmock for Edwards also, the spelling the same for Wall......Sorry that was really only two but two lists........ Then lo and bloody behold, I found another, and this is me 6th great grandpa! Lunenburg Co Tithables - 1748 Alexr. Wawmock/no tithes listed/400 acres.......... So y'all rest easy those all I found different in VA(so far)..what was ironic is that a George Brewer was also on the Brunswick Poll list, and he is me 6th great on my mothers side!!!


Sunday, February 21, 1999 at 11:36:48 (PST)
Steve Womack
Swomack@Home.Com

I was going through an old scrapbook and found an article from the McMinnville Southern Standard from the 1950s with the caption " Some 150 decendants of Thomas A. and Louvisa Rice Womack from 11 states were present Sunday for the second annual reunion of the Womack family, held at the fairgrounds here. Those taking prizes for attending from the most distant point and being the oldest decendant present are shown above with the reunion committee. Dick Womack, Murfreesboro, Miss Daisy Womack, Mcminnviile, Lee Roy Womack III, Linda Ann Womack, and Kelly Peel. J. D. Womack and Joe H. Womack, Mcminnville, Mrs. Lee Roy Womack Jr,and Mr Womack, Mr. and Mrs. Harold W. Morgan, Mrs. Opha Lynn Peel and Mary Ruth Peel. Miss Womack took the prize for being the oldest, and The Lee Roy Womacks, Morgans and Peels for comming the greatest distance. Joe H., Dick, and J. D. Womack formed the reunion committee. The Lee Roy Womacks attended from Oklahoma, the Morgans from California and the Peels from Florida." A picture with those individuals was also included. If anyone wants a copy of this article, please let me know.


Sunday, February 21, 1999 at 12:04:04 (PST)
Michael L Womack
mlwomack@mindspring.com

I'm very new at this and don't have alot to go on. I have just started the search and only know about my father Maurice L Womack b.Jan 1934, married to Dorothy E. Dennis. His father George Willard Womack b. in MO and moved to Wellington,Ks. He married Fannie Anne Traft he died in 1948. That's really all I know at this point. I hope that some one can help me fill in some blanks.


Sunday, February 21, 1999 at 14:41:55 (PST)
Joyce Wommack
joylin@henge.com

To Virginia Sue Rieckhoff; I have a record of your William Wesley & Sarah (McFarrell) Womack. He was the son of Abraham & Elizabeth (Shumaker) Womack. Ref: The descendants of Thomas & Louvisa (Rice) Womack by Oscar B. Womack. pages 18 & 28. I don't have any descendants for William & Sarah though.


Monday, February 22, 1999 at 08:21:44 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.mail

Sam, thanks for posting the information. Every little bit helps.


Monday, February 22, 1999 at 15:27:30 (PST)
Bonnie L. Womack
blwo

This message is for Virginia Sue Rieckhoff. I need an email address for you, so I can send the information that I have on William Wesley Womack. The William that is in our family is also a school teacher. We still have his books from his teaching days. Please contact me as soon as possible.


Monday, February 22, 1999 at 18:31:49 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com
http://198.17.62.51/cgi-bin/drawer/disk19/CC150/0343/A0014?3

OK, so here is a fly in the ointment. We have previously discussed the possibility that the Richard Womack that received the land patent in 1672/1673 may have recieved the headrights as a dower from his father-in-law, John Puckett. We came up with this theory to explain the fact that someone only 18 years old was able to claim 9 headrights. Even if he was old enough to patent land, having 9 headrights does seem like quite an accomplishment for someone so young. For the moment, let's accept this theory as truth. So, how do we explain the next land patent of James Akin & Richard Womack, May 26, 1673 in Henrico Co for 335 acres on the North side of Appamattock river? Mr. Homer Wilson has said that James Akin was in his 30's-40's. Why would he enter into a land patent with a person half his age? What plausible situation would explain this? I have included a link to the patent at the Library of Virginia web site. -Mark


Monday, February 22, 1999 at 18:49:28 (PST)
Frank Entwisle
FE_Artifex@compuserve.com

I am researching my fathers side of the family, his mother was Katie Cecelia Womack. Her father was Sam Womack, and mother was Alma Stroud. There were two other sisters, Sadie and Alma. Katie was born 1/19/1890 and died 11/25/1973. She and my grandfather Harry Service Entwisle were married in (of course) Richmond Va 3/2/1907. Supposedly ran off from Alexandria where my Entwisle relatives were.The strouds were apparently from/ went to the Lincoln Nb area and my Grandfather and Katie Womack took the kids there during the depression looking for work. My grandfather was always in the glass business, blowing it and/or running a bottle making plant. Any help would be appreciated, thanks. Frank


Monday, February 22, 1999 at 19:54:15 (PST)
Joyce Wommack
joylin@henge.com

Has anyone seen this before? It was sent to me by a family researcher and she believes it is in reference to John (wifebeater) whom we have Mary AKIN as his spouse. (599- ADVENTURERS OF PURSE AND PERSON) ìLucy Temple, William temple of Prince George County, Virginia and His Descendants, (Richmond, 1978), pp 52-55, 130-31, 173-74. Two other children are tentatively assigned to 13. Rebecca (Tatum) TEMPLE, without proof; Ann, married to Thomas Leath, and MARY, MARRIED TO JOHN WOMACK. ìWilliam Temple of Warrickhock Swamp, Charles City County, later Prince George County....ancient planter.î


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 05:39:22 (PST)
aSam
samsawadee@uswest.net

From the "For What It Is Worth" department.................................... Headrights were grants of 50 acres of land per "head" - or per white male over the age of 16 who transported himself to the colonies. They appear in the Court of Common Pleas in the county in which the land was granted........Mebbe this will kinda clear the age grouping up a lil bit?


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 13:14:25 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Does anyone know who the parents of the Mary Akin m John (wife beater/hog stealer) Womack? I'm at work and don't have my notes handy...maybe it is James Akin?! -Mark


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 13:18:38 (PST)
Carolyn Powell
powell@blueridge.net

While looking through photocopies of cemeteries of Callaway County, MO for another family, I saw WOMACK CEMETERY, Callaway Co., Compiled by Al Ewens & S. T. Lawson, 8 Sept 1983: WOMACK, sARAH a., 1854-1934; WOMACK, Allen, of Bedford Co., VA, d ? Jan 1882, Aged 69 yrs, 6 m, 20 days; WOMACK, Virgil, 1856-1861; WOMACK, Florella, 1857-1863; WOMACK, Meander A., 1858-1937; WOMACK, Allan, 1824-1893; WOMACK, Sarah B., 1826-1895; WOMACK, Samuel, 1843-1862; WOMACK, Lillian, 1845-1862; WOMACK, Daniel, 1847-1927; WOMACK, Nowlin, 1849-1936. MORRIS CEMETERY, Callaway Co., MO: Womack, Annie, Daughter of D & N Womack, Born in Bedrod County, Virginia on Dec 4 1804, d Feb 14, 1861 in Callaway Co., MO. As some of you know, I am researching the Jacob Womack family of Callaway Co. and I have NO idea who these people are. If you will note, most of them have names you don't usually see associated with the earlier Womacks.


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 13:20:29 (PST)
David Dunn
ddunn@keys.4ez.com

On the age question. This afternoon I called the Virginia State Library, and spoke to a senior staff member in the Archives and Records Division, Mr. Clay, an expert on land records. He informed me that in the Colonial era there was absolutely no age requirement for receiving land by patent. You had to be 21 to enter into a contract, i.e. to buy and sell land by deed, but not to receive patents and grants. As for headrights, again no age limit, as long as you had the money to pay for them.


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 14:12:38 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

David, thanks for making that phone call! Another good question to ask, and I don't know if anyone knows the answer to this, is what was the average age of people patenting land? And, how much did passage from England to Virginia cost back then, anyways? A day's wages, a month, a year, life savings? It always amazes me how quickly deep genealogy questions always lead to a need to understand the social, political, and economic contexts of the time period in which our ancestors lived. At least it seems so to me... -Mark


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 14:58:44 (PST)
Mike Womack
mlwomack@mindspring.com

Would like to add to and correct message posted by my wife on 2-19.We have just started researching the Womack family and are looking forward to using this site,for giving and receiving info.my grandfather was George Willard Womack b. Jan.01,1899 in Marsfield Mo. d. Aug. 1960 in Wellington, Sumner county Ks.My gr grandfather was Dorsey Bristol Womack b. (date unknown) in Marsfield Mo. d. Mar. 1952 in Wellington, Sumner county Ks. He had 3 sons George Willard,Henry and Rome. I don't know henry or rome's middle names. If anyone has any info on this line of the womack name please e-mail me thanks. mike


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 16:28:29 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

David.... In your message you stated there was no age limit for patents and grants....but they had to be 21 in order to enter in to a contract or deed... I have a copy of the 1783 tax list for Virginia, Alexander paid the taxes for William Womack next to William it says " minor ". This William later married Margaret Ellis. The reason some believe he was his son..... I guess my question is, could someone be given property under 21 but could not buy it?


Tuesday, February 23, 1999 at 18:34:18 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Recently we have been discussing William and what proof is there that he was the forefather of most of our clan....We have all had concerns about some of the early generations whether they are attached to the right parents..... I have been in touch with another Womack researcher who has as Mark said "another fly in the ointment" Thomas Womack (c 1728- 1804), son of Thomas Womack and Mary Farley, as is established by by the estate papers of William Womack Charlotte Co., died a day or two before the sale of Williams slaves, which occured 4feb1804. Thomas left a will in Nottoway Co., dated 14dec1803, (WB 1: 78) naming his wife Mary and daughter Martha Hurt and a grandson Anthony H. Womack --- to whom he left "my interest in the estate of my brother William Womack" ..... In Carlos book and in the PAF, also in many of our database files this son is listed as Thomas and Sarah Woodson who had a son Thomas who married a Sarah also all leaving wills. He believes these Thomas' to be the son of Richard Jr. I'm anxiously a waiting a package he is sending. There is no doubt that the Thomas who left a will in Nottoway is the correct Thomas because of some recent papers with the plaintiffs information from Joyce clearly attests to Thomas leaving his grandson Anthony H. Womack his share....I wondering if anyone has any more information on this?


Wednesday, February 24, 1999 at 16:31:02 (PST)
jan
womack@mcmail.com

David, sorry for the delay in posting. Will get down to it asap. Sam, Mark, David etc. just had a VERY interesting long communication from Geoffrey womack in Pickering Nth Yorks via my husbands hospital. Rather than trace his family backwards (which I think I've done for him now anyway), he has spent years simply tracing the origin of the name nad has come up with something very interesting. Hold your breath! I will send it out to David. Geoffrey's daughter Helen Womack was the Reuters Moscow correspondent. now works as Russian correspondent with The Independent. Turns out she's my age and went to the same Leeds Girls School that my daughter's go to. She has recently had a book published (October) to do with Russian Spies!


Wednesday, February 24, 1999 at 18:14:48 (PST)
SAm
samsawadee@uswest.net

Aww Jan!! Dang it!! post it heah! we all got E-mail and can read yer writin too!


Wednesday, February 24, 1999 at 21:06:15 (PST)
Jim Cooper
JasLCooper@aol.com

I am looking for information on JESSE W. WOMACK, b. 1813 in Georgia, d. 1880 in Texas. He married Martha Emmanuel, b. 1817 in Georgia, d. 1895 in Texas. They are buried in Travis County, Texas, however they lived in Williamson County, Texas. Jesse W. Womack had a store in Taylor, Texas in the late 1800s.


Wednesday, February 24, 1999 at 21:25:45 (PST)
Markie
mowen@linknet.net

TO EVERYONE, I just wanted to say that I love this discussion of our early Womacks! I read every post. I'm like Joyce, I have read and studied these Womacks for so long, I'm confused too. I have spent more time hunting two of the wives rather than the men folks. Great going David! A good phone call! (A day's wages, a month, a year, life savings?) Mark, I love your questions too. That will be very interesting to know the answer. Jan, how long do we have to hold our breath??? I'm with Sam, Tell, Tell!! I'm really proud of everyone who is working so hard! Go Cousins!!!


Wednesday, February 24, 1999 at 21:43:29 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Roger, Are you saying that Richard II whom had Alexander and Richard III, poss had sons named Thomas and William Also?? That is what I am getting out of what you said below.. , Since III was allegedly born Jul 12, 1710 it is obvious II and his wife had more than the two boys. Since II was born in abt 1674, at age 36 he would have had to had more children me thinks.. If this is true and we take the loose naming sequence of his father/her father/him..we would need all the children of II and Elizabeth Ann to come to any conclusions..by the sequence III could have been first born as well as third!! However, this is all moot since FTM and its idiotic inability to merge properly had II marrying his mothers sister!! So my file is rather corrupt at the moment and since I have thoroughly muddled this up..would you send me what you have from William to Richard III? perhaps I can recover this bloody thing to some degree?


Wednesday, February 24, 1999 at 23:36:28 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Sam....sometimes what I am trying to say just don't come out as planned. I think the late 60 & 70's was a little rough on me. I'm awaiting a package to help sort this out. However, Thomas son of Thomas Womack and Mary Farley, I have in my database as the Thomas who married married Sarah Woodson and had a son named Thomas who married a Sarah also. We have all their Wills in the old Womack newsletters. But due to some recent information I see that Thomas that married Sarah Woodson is not the son of Thomas and Mary Farley. He had a wife named Mary a daughter named Martha and a grandson named Anthony H. Womack who he left his part of the estate of his brother William Womack of Charlotte Co., also the son of Thomas Womack and Farley. The Thomas Sr. b abt1705 sp Sarah Woodson (Hubert also said there is no proof of her last name Woodson ) above he believes he is the son of Richard II. who's brother was Alexander. I'll let you know when I get the Will's what we have here. Thomas and Mary Farleys Thomas b abt 1728 left his Will in Nottoway Co., in 1803. and died in 1804.


Thursday, February 25, 1999 at 04:48:30 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Roger, and all: I supose you all have a William b. abt 1670, d, bef 1762, married to a Mary Woodson who had a brother named Thomas b. abt 1670ish d. unknown and I have no wife. My Williams file shows this same William and Mary but William born about 1682...this William being a son of Abraham and Sumercales? (Williams file spelling)..So it is quite obvious that Woodsons were around there in Henrico Co. Perhaps we need to look into the Woodson area and see what developes..Will try to do that this weekend, time permitting.


Thursday, February 25, 1999 at 15:18:18 (PST)
Cody Bruce
cody_bruce@yahoo.com
http://www.angelfire.com/la/beanpole/

My name is Cody Bruce. I have all my family information on the internet. Please visit my site and tell me if you have any more information. http://www.angelfire.com/la/beanpole/


Thursday, February 25, 1999 at 16:56:00 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

All, Homer Wilson sent me some information showing that the Mary Akin m John Womack (Mr. Hog Stealer) was the daughter of James Akin that patented the land with Richard Womack in 1673. It's not definite proof, but it does lend weight, in my mind, that there was an elder Richard Womack whose sons married the daughters of men with adjacent or shared land (ie John Puckett, James Akin). What I don't understand is, if this elder Richard died (before 1724, I can't remember the 'younger' Richard's date of death off hand), why isn't there more of a record? With all of these other records surviving, it seems like something would be mentioned somewhere. Also, given the laws at the time, who would have inherited all of the land? Eldest son Abraham? Is there a way to track it through inheritances? Has anyone had any luck finding any records that might point to William The Immigrant? Beyond the Thomas/Abraham controversy, I don't see any suggestion that he existed. I'm going to try and start writing the article tonight. I'll let everyone know where the draft ends up. -Mark


Thursday, February 25, 1999 at 17:59:54 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

In Captain W. Byrds Letters Vol 1-11-64....To Thomas Grendon per Zack Taylor.... April the 25th 1684..... Dear Sir, This I hope will come to your hands to congratulate your safe arrival in England, having little news to send, all being well at your house. The general Assembly is now sitting, and your neighbor Hill Speaker. I hope all things will go on smoothly...... Old Sturdivant, his son Millner Shipy, Womacke, and Hugh Cassell were all killed by the Indians in their returne from the Westward, about 30 miles beyond Ochanechee. ... So we can assume Womack was killed before the 25 of April 1684 and I believed it was Richard as he was the only Womack killed by the Indians at this time. Richards wife married John Granger in 1690. Mark, I don't know if this helps but may be another peice of the puzzle.


Friday, February 26, 1999 at 04:33:54 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

All this about William vs Richard verrry intellesting...I dont think anyone is denying that many of us descend from Richard...but how do we account for a William in the ointment?? Is he fer real or the figment of someone's overworked imagination?


Friday, February 26, 1999 at 10:27:09 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Roger, yes, it seems that given the appraisement in 1684, everyone agrees that the Richard killed in 1684 was the husband of Mary Puckett, and he is the brother of Abraham, John, etc. I wonder why the letter doesn't mention his entire name...? And according to Homer, this would have been the younger Richard. Hmm. Maybe we need to know more about the letter writer and the others mentioned in this letter. There may be some clues there. Sam, unless someone is sitting on some info they aren't telling us about, the only reference I can find is the William with children Mary & Thomas and Timothy Allen guardian. This information could be twisted to interpret as a William being the father of Abraham, Richard, John, & Thomas, but only if you accept that the Thomas is a brother of this Abraham when the will is contested later. But it is also possible (with lack of proof, one has to admit the possibility) that the later Thomas and Abraham are members of a next generation. Other than this, I have found no proof or reference to a William or Mary Jane Womack. They appear to be figments at this point. But we are always open to more information... -Mark


Friday, February 26, 1999 at 12:11:39 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Mark, I did not finish the letter, here's the rest after Ochanechee:...What prejudice it is to see you my guesse, they having (had they come well in) made a very advantagous journey. On Easter monday I spoke with 50 Seneca Indians about 12 miles above my house; they had promised to behave themselves hereafter very peacable toward the English. I shall not trouble you further at present, but with my best respects and service to yourselfe and all our friends, wishing all health and prosperity, I am, Sir. Your reall friend and Servent W.B..........Jack Warren and Will Randolph our worthy Burgesses, frequently drinke your health....Pray and be mindfull of my Shoes and Boots & C. Source: The Virginia Historical Register Vol. 1-11-64 Capt. Byrds Letters.


Friday, February 26, 1999 at 19:03:00 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Point of interest--Ok there was a Womack killed in a Native American uprising or whatever..now, it appears that this bunch of people was a kind of militia sent out..perhaps we need to explore the avenue of whose militia, and who were members of it?? Now we need some of y'all VA peeps to start getting yer feet wet and transgressin them swamps of the VA archives..Someone take that, someone look hard at the Allens, theah may be clues..as I said I am going Woodson hunting this weekend after I get off work Sat..now a concerted all out effort and sharing of info, even if duplicated, needed heah and now!..We aint got a flag, but rally to it anyway girls and boys!!


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 01:36:45 (PST)
Markie
mowen@linknet.net
http://www.geocities.com:80/Heartland/Flats/1118/rwom.htm

Roger, Mark, Sam, and everyone else. I have place a copy of the letter along with one of Richard Womack's land records on the above URL. It is not linked to any of my pages at this time, so everyone will have to click on the above URL to get there. J I copied this from a book about 20 years ago, and I did not write the title on itÖ So I guess it was: "The Virginia Historical Register"Ö not sure tho. Maybe it will be a little bit easier to read like this. Anyone is welcome to save it to their computer by right clicking on the letter, then just "save image". I hope to be placing more of the records online like this as time permits. I hope this helps in some wayÖÖAlso do not forget what it says in "VOL. II, NO. 1 - JUNE 1958 - (page 1) of the Womack Newsletters which are posted here on WGNÖ.. It seems that lots of records were lost on early VirginiaÖ.. "Unfortunately, many of Henrico's earliest records have been destroyed. Will records are missing in Henrico for the fol. lowing years: 1634-1676, 1719-17241 1738-17431 1758-1766 and 1770-1773 (thus approximately 40% of Henrico's will records prior to 1800 are lost). Both William Womack I (our immigrant ancestor) and his son, William Womack II, died in Henrico prior to 1677, so they do not appear on record. Also, a large number of Womacks settled in the early 1700's in that part of Prince George County which became Dinwiddie County in 1752. Dinwiddie records have been completely destroyed (a 100% loss), and the records of wills before 1800 for Prince George County have been destroyed for the years 1702-1712, 1729-1786, and 1793-1800 (a 78% loss). These tragic losses in Henrico, Dinwiddie and Prince George Coun. ties have been and will continue to be severe handicaps in the tracing of the various branches of our Womack family in Virginia"ÖÖthis could account for not finding records on William I our immigrantÖÖ Markie


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 04:40:29 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Markie, thankee for that tidbit....now one for all from some notes which were so graciously sent by Roger and I quote:... "William Womack married Mary Jane Allen, a widow" Perhaps the key is "widow" and Allen is not the maiden name after all?? Mebbe we dawgs barkin' up the wrong tree? Not on William, but his wife..I am not saying that Allens are not conected as it does appear that back then even remarried sis-in-law were still considered part of the family---Whose widow was she? Keep in mind there was a William Allen in the colonies by 1623, indentured (text said servant and I prefer the former word) to someone...so did he have a wife or daughter that became a widow and William stepped in and married her? Guess who came over the same year as this William Allen?? Thomas and Mary Farley! Who had a daughter either on boat or right after landing!! Dang, aint this mysterious stuff fun!!!


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 09:41:20 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Sam... In "Womack Genealogy" by Maxine Hulse Tinkham it says: "He married the widow, Mary Allen, in Henrico Co., Virginia, where he lived on the James River. She came to the Colony prior to June 2, 1636 on a Land patent of Robert Hallon"......No source listed other than this statement. If we can find this patent perhaps it will give us a few more clues as to who she was or connection to William.


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 11:06:57 (PST)
Jim M. Cowan
jcowan@feist.com

Thanks for posting my success story. I really meant it when I wrote what a great group the Womacks are. A small quibble--at the top of my success story, I am identified as the grandson of Rosa and Nathan Turner Womack. Actually, I am the grandson of Rosa and the great grandson of Nathan. Thanks for all your help. I find your current research fascinating and wish I knew something I could add. Jim Cowan


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 17:36:19 (PST)
Robert E. Womack Moore
R6CTommore@aol.com

Years ago in a book entitled, "Adventurers of Purse and Person," I found the following about the death of Richard Womack in 1684. On pp 351 after citing the story of the death of "Old Sturdivant, his son, Millner, Shipy, Womacke and Hugh Cassell..." from William Byrd I, in a foot note the following is given: " 18 Marion Tinling, ed., The Correspondence of the Three Williams Byrds of Westover, Virginia, 1684-1776 (Charlottesville, 1977), I, pp. 15-16. The date of this letter may have been later in the year. Letters of administration on the estates of John Milner, Thomas Shippy, Richard Womeck (and John Davis) were granted to their widows at the same Henrico County court, 1 Aug 1684, and all of these men's inventories show some connection with the Indian trade: Indian boys and girls, trading knives, a tomahawk, Indian baskets(Henrico Co. Wills and Deeds 1677-92, pp 282-90). The Occaneechee Trail or Path led from Fort Henry (Petersburg) through Occaneechee Town (near present Clarksville, Mecklenburg County), close to the Forks of the Dan and Roanoke rivers. Twenty miles west of that would be present Person Co., N.C." End of footnote


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 18:04:59 (PST)
Robert E. Womack Moore
R6CTommore@aol.com

Mark, Roger, Sam, all: in searching some of my records today I found the following; in a book-"The Story of Cumberland County, Virginia" by Garland Evans Hopkins---The Cumberland County Series Historical Monograph No 3, published 1942. On page 14 is this statement, "In 1627 among the tithables in Henrico were listed these surnames: Elan, Eppes, Randolph, Carter, Harris, Childress, Woodson, Pleasants, Haether, Watkins, Newcomb, Baugh, Lygon, Womecke, Clerke, Allen, Lockett, Willson, Perkins, Parker." My notes indicate I found this in May, 1981. It looks to me as if the Womacks (by any spelling) were in Virginia very early. As I remember there is a statement in one of the Womack Family Genealogy issues in which a lady claimed she had seen a Womack will from the 1630s in Virginia in a Chicago library but she never gave the source to my knowledge.


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 18:14:36 (PST)
Markie
mowen@linknet.net

I found the below notes in my files. Everyone may have already seen this, but it's been so long since I checked these files, I didn't remember it........ Does this help with Richard's age???....... I don't remember looking at the reference listed, or where I got this. This is a lesson that I learned long ago..... "always write down your sources!...... This is what I get for starting genealogy young, and not knowing I would ever share with anyone who would be interested.......NOTE: Richard Womack I (William I, the Immigrant) b VA /England 1654-1555. He was about 24 yrs old on 2 Jun l679 (Ref: Henrico Ct. Rec. Vol 1677-1692 p. 90). d Bristol Parish, Henrico Co VA intestate. His wife Mary was administrator of his estate by 1 Oct 1684. m Henrico Co VA before 1676 (birth of Richard, Jr.) t o Mary Puckett, etc.....


Saturday, February 27, 1999 at 19:14:29 (PST)
Robert E. Womack Moore
R6CTommore@aol.com

Mark, Roger, Sam, all. Another tidbit: In a book, "Chesterfield---An Old Virginia County" by Frances Earle Lutz published by William Byrd Press, Inc.-- 1954. On pp 48 is the following statement, "Nicholas Perkins in 1650 received another patent in the Bermuda Hundred section. Other settlers around this period included Francis Redford, in 1659, and John Puckett, John Burton and Abraham and William Womack, in 1665."


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 00:09:59 (PST)
Sam
samsawadee@uswest.net

Ok--didnt find a 1627 Tithe list, so clad someone did; However, did find the following that might be of interest: VA-1624 Census Woodson John Head of HH John Woodson Piersleys Hundred George 1619 1624-01-20 Woodson Sarah wife John Woodson Piersleys Hundred George 1619 1624-01-20.... 1679 Tythables For Henrico County Court holden att Varina for the County of Henrico the second day of June Anno Dom 1679... Curls... John Woodson Sr 3... John Woodson Jr 2... Robert Woodson 5... Abrah Womecke 2... Turkey Island... Tim Allen 1 ... Tho Puckett 2 ... Jno Puckett 1 ... Wm Puckett 2 ... Another 1624 census??... 1624 ELIZABETH CITY CO. VA ALLEN , William... 1624 FLOURDIEN HUNDRED VA WOODSON , John... 1624 FLOURDIEN HUNDRED VA WOODSON , Sarah... William Allen came in as an indenture in 1623--whether this is an Allen related to our genealogy--dont know--but promising as a starting point..These Woodsons tho are apparently the forerunners of the Woodsons that figure in with our research. Looks like we got some interest going -- lets keep it up!!


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 11:23:54 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Does anyone know of a source for the Henrico 1627 tithable list? Is ther an index someplace? -Mark


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 13:00:52 (PST)
Robert E. Womack Moore
R6CTommore@aol.com

Mark: In my notes for "The Story of Cumberland County, Virginia," as references for the Womack name in the book I have: William & Mary College Quarterly, 1st series, 15 W(1) 247 and 43 V 268. I don't have access to this Quarterly and haven't been able to check what is there. Also I understand from Overton's Genealogy Handbook, there are printed censuses for Virginia for 1624, 1625 & 1626. Again I don't have access to any of this. Bob


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 15:03:11 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com
http://www.jstor.org/journals/00435597.html

W & M Quarterly is available online at the page above. I'm going to do a quick search right now... -Mark


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 15:08:38 (PST)
Webmaster
wgnwebmaster@womacknet.com

Well, I take that back. That site used to let you search the W&M database, but it is now restricted. So much for the open information super highway. If anyone has access to W&M, let us know. -Mark


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 15:09:55 (PST)
Joyce L Martin
martt@ldd.net
http://www.listbot.com/cgi-bin/view_archive?Act=view_message&list_id=allenJ&msg_num=92&start_num=98

Because I have Allens in my family I look at an Allen site frequently. You might be interested in seeing their records re Mary Allen m to Wm Womack. Not saying this is right or wrong, just for your info.


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 16:41:02 (PST)
Mark Womack
markwomack@womacknet.com

Joyce, I know quite a bit about Womack's in Halifax Co, VA. I don't think that the Mary Allen (#9) on the page you listed is the same Mary Jane Allen that supposedly married William Womack the immigrant. It is too late in the time line (1762). I don't have my notes handy, but I think I do have info in this couple listed, however. -Mark


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 17:51:39 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Received the package from Hubert and the Will of Thomas of Nottoway 1803, is the Thomas sp Mary the son of Thomas sp Mary Farley. So now We need to prove the Thomas sp Sarah Woodson? I'm using Woodson no proof of her. was the son of Richard Jr. as Hubert believes, he is sending more info on this. Also He believes Francis sp Susanna Puckett had at least 3 sons. Pleasant, Isham and William who I have been trying to prove is my William. Pleasant was born about 1755, On 4 Jan 1782, Francis was granted administration of his estate ( OB 6: 337 ). Isham b abt 1760 was on the 1783 tax list in Chesterfield Co., VA., with 5 whites in his household, he believes he was named after his uncle Isham. And then there is William who married Elizabeth Purkinson 9 May 1791 in Chesterfield Co., VA. and possibly had a son named Francis J.b abt1802, who married Nancy Gill. If this is my William then he had to get rid of wife and child to marry my Catherine by 1810. still searching.


Sunday, February 28, 1999 at 18:03:57 (PST)
Roger Womack
MLWomack@aol.com

Does anyone have any information on Josiah Womack son of Thomas Womack sp Sarah Woodson? who's will was written 18 sep 1800, probate 4 Dec 1800 children: William, Bird, Rebecca, Edith, Millie or Willie, and Eliza. Hubert believes this William could be mine.


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